JustTom wrote:

I think you were and are exaggerating.


Well, what is the Cincy media going to say about it's new GM? he's a
doofus?


I didn't mean to imply that Gibbons was blameless in the Hillenbrand
affair, as he may have escalated the suituation, but I have a feeling
many would come in second to Hillenbrand in an a-hole competition.


I'm not aware of what happened with Lilly.

"Kevin McClave" <kmcclave@twcny.rr.com> wrote in

Pitcher being pulled from the game disagreed with management and was
demonstrative about it.

wiki is so cool for recent events. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Lilly
"On August 21, 2006, in a game against the Oakland Athletics, Lilly had a
public dispute with Jays manager John Gibbons. When Gibbons came out to the
mound to take out Lilly after he gave up 5 runs in one inning (he was later
charged with a total of seven after two inherited runners scored), the
pitcher verbally challenged Gibbons' decision. When Lilly entered the
dugout, he collected his equipment and headed for the clubhouse. According
to eye-witnesses, Gibbons followed Lilly into the clubhouse tunnel and
pushed him. A scuffle apparently ensued and Gibbons was seen on camera
afterwards with a bloodied nose. [1] After the game, both Gibbons and Lilly
claimed the situation had been resolved. During Lilly's next start, against
the Kansas City Royals on August 27 (an eventual 10-6 Jays' win), there was
no sign of animosity between the pitcher and his manager."

"Interestingly, since the confrontation, Lilly has gone 5-2 and his ERA has
dropped from 4.63 to 4.31 in improving from 10-11 to 15-13. His contract
will expire in the offseason, but there have been indications that he will
re-sign with the Blue Jays."

Lots of smoke around Gibbons, (and that whole franchise) but they don't seem
to be coming apart at the seems. It has to suck being on a franchise in the
AL east.

dfs

On Wed, 11 Oct 2006 12:32:32 -0400, "David Short"
<David.no.Short@Wright.spam.Edu.please> wrote:


Wife and I watched the game on big screen in HiDef. We both saw it
on the mound and said "what was that all about?". Rewound the dvr
several times to watch it and get the lip reading right.

I disagree with the wiki assertion that Lilly challenged Gibbons. It
was the other way around, at least in the beginning.

Toronto had scored in the previous inning to go up 8-0. Then Lilly
came in and I believe walked a batter,gave a couple of massive HRs and
one or two doubles in a rapid succession of hits. They were rocking
him hard.

When Gibbons came out, Lilly was simply staring off into space. As
Gibbons came up, he said "Why are you out here fvcking around trying
to give it away?"

Lilly looked at him and said "what?!?"

Gibbons said, "just get the fvck out of here."

Then Lilly went off and said "I'm not fvcking around, I'm trying to
win a GD game, WTF are YOU doing here?", and then wouldn't let go when
Gibbons tried to take the ball from him. He finally let go, and
stomped off, talking back over his shoulder the whole time.

They were both wrong on the mound, but I can attribute that to heat of
battle, and a pitcher who just got shelled coming out too early to get
a win after starting an inning with an 8 run lead.

The problem I have came after Gibbons came off the field. Instead of
just going back to the bench and letting things cool off, he basically
forgot he was managing a game on the field, and went down into the
clubhouse and chased Lilly down. What happened next is a mystery,
but bodies sure flew down the tunnel in a hurry, apparantly to pull
Lilly off of him.

It was neat to see the group dynamics afterwards. You could really
see who the leaders of the team were, as groups of players each
huddled around 2 guys, asking them what the deal was and watching to
see what they were going to do. Not surprisingly, the two guys
were Halladay and Wells.



He certainly seems to be the confrontational type. I just don't
think Wells likes him very much, and I don't get the sense that the
team has much confidence in him. Management has certainly stuck by
him, when it seems like he may be at the very least, a distraction.

On 11 Oct 2006 09:21:58 -0700, "Kevin McClave" <kmcclave@twcny.rr.com>
wrote:


That's fine, I guess you didn't read the post.

Here it is:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt....e95e836a1dbf73e

The quote I was referring to:
"Krivksy is one of the best evaluators in the game. Hands down. I wish
I had a fifth of his talent. In Wayne you should trust."

Other than actually saying "I want to portray him as a genious", I
don't see how that statement could be interpreted any more clearly.



I alluded to many other media outlets who don't have the same
interests as Cinci writers, but I don't really recall the Cinci media
doing much gushing over Dan O's hiring.

JustTom wrote:

I read many of the same things you did, I figure, and your "tone" about
Krivsky's reputation seems like it has the baggage of your
post-conceived notion of him on it. Like I said, I think your somewhat
derogatory and snide use of "genius" seems an overstatement for the way
Krivsky has been portrayed.

On Wed, 11 Oct 2006 09:31:15 -0400, "David Short"
<David.no.Short@Wright.spam.Edu.please> wrote:


Heheh...WHAT???

Blondes/Donkeys is a perfectly valid comparison.

Both can be stubborn as all get out.

Both attract attention to themselves via their behavior.

Both can be a pretty wild ride. And I don't mean that in the sexual
sense, either. Not regarding donkeys, anyway.

John D, Kasupski, Tonawanda, NY
Reds Fan Since The 1960's
http://kc2hmz.net

Kevin McClave wrote:

No problem, just sayin'...

On Wed, 11 Oct 2006 17:44:33 GMT, tom@nomail.please (JustTom) wrote:


Being good at one particular part of your job neither makes you a genius
nor necessarily good at your job overall, even. And it was one guy on a
newsgroup.

Nothing at all near "most want to portray him as" a genius. You
exaggerated.

************************************************** ********************
Kevin McClave

"The reward of suffering is experience." ~Aeschylus
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